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Let's Talk Science
by Richard D Kloosman
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Let’s Talk Science!

“Give science a fact and it is invincible. But who can guess more wildly than a scientist, when he has no compass but his imagination, and no purpose but to get away from God. Darwin uses the phrase "we may well suppose" 800 times and wins for himself a high place among the unconscious humorists by his efforts to explain things that are not true.”
William Jennings Bryan (1860-1925) Mr. Bryan on Evolution, Reader’s Digest August 1925

If you did not like science at school, don’t worry I am not going to bore you with scientific babble, quite the opposite actually, there might just be some entertainment value in what I have written. In one of my previous articles I have asked the question, if evolution was scientific or based on pure science, well the same can be asked of the Bible. Do you think that the Bible is in trouble when science is putting it to the test?

Before we answer this question, let me just say that science do not validate nor is it needed to validate the Bible. If science disagrees with the Bible then science is in trouble and not the Bible. Nevertheless, let us say for the sake of the argument that if we should use operational science to test the Bible what would be the outcome?

It is a historical fact that the science of today has a lot to be thankful for to the men of God who just happened to be scientists. Men like Louis Pasteur (biology), Johannes Kepler (astronomy), Michael Faraday (chemistry and electricity), Sir Isaac Newton (physics) and Wernher von Braun (PhD Aerospace Engineering) these men took up science because of their understanding that God made everything in order and with laws governing them. Their studies convinced them that there was a God and with that understanding they advanced human scientific know how.

That is in startling contrast to today’s atheistic scientists who are sometimes out to prove the Bible wrong and their fanciful theories right. Scientists of old had no quibbles about the Bible and its claims; in fact the Bible spurred them on to the heights they reached. The Bible was certainly never a hindrance to operational science and its advances. Like it was said in a previous article, it is what is phrased historical science that which has to do with the studies of origins that the Bible certainly does not agree with. Did the Bible impede science? Just read the following:

“The scientist is possessed by the sense of universal causation... His religious feeling takes the form of a rapturous amazement at the harmony of natural law, which reveals an intelligence of such superiority that, compared with it, all systematic thinking and acting of human beings is an utterly insignificant reflection.”
Albert Einstein, Ideas and Opinions, p. 40
“God is known by nature in his works, and by doctrine in his revealed word.”
Galileo Galilei (1564 - 1642)
“The more I study nature, the more I am amazed at the Creator.”
Louis Pasteur (1822 - 1895)
“The most beautiful system of the sun, planets, and comets, could only proceed from the counsel and dominion of an intelligent and powerful Being. A Heavenly Master governs all the world as Sovereign of the universe. We are astonished at Him by reason of His perfection, we honor Him and fall down before Him because of His unlimited power… Whom I call the Lord God.”
Isaac Newton (1642 - 1727)
My experiences with science led me to God. They challenge science to prove the existence of God. But must we really light a candle to see the sun? Wernher von Braun  (1912 – 1977)  PhD  Aerospace Engineering A letter to the California State board of Education   September 14, 1972

What did Christians mean to the advancement of life on earth? Well if you drink pasteurized milk, does God come up in your mind? No, of course not, however a man of God was the one who were responsible for that technology. Louis Pasteur was responsible for the cure for anthrax, rabies, silkworm diseases, and chicken cholera a sort of chicken sickness of his time and of course he was responsible for the pasteurization of milk to make it last longer. If you look into a reflecting telescope or do calculus, do you think of God, because a man of God, Sir Isaac Newton was responsible for the development of both. When you look at the orbits of planets around the sun, do you know that it was actually a Christian believing in creation that was first to explain that planets moved in elliptical orbits around the sun? Johannes Kepler was that man.

If you start your car every morning do you know that a born again believer in Jesus was responsible for the technology, which made electric motors like your cars starter motor possible? Michael Faraday was that man. And finally when you think of people landing on the moon, and the US space program did you know a Bible believing Christian played a major leading part in the establishment of NASA? Wernher Von Braun was that man.

Of Isaac Newton it was said that he was “the chief figure of the scientific revolution of the 17th century”. Of Johannes Kepler it was said, “It was Kepler who invented the present-day form of astronomical telescope” and . “He was also the first to explain correctly how human beings see and to demonstrate what happens to light when it enters a telescope.” Of Pasteur it was said, “His discoveries have saved countless lives and created new wealth for the world”. Of Michael Faraday it was said, “When the great scientist Sir Humphrey Davy was asked what he considered his greatest discovery, he answered, "Michael Faraday”.” And of Wernher Von Braun it was said “He is generally regarded as the father of the United States space program” and “Apollo program director Sam Phillips was quoted as saying that he did not think that America would have reached the moon as quickly as it did without von Braun's help. Later, after discussing it with colleagues, he amended this to say that he did not believe America would have reached the moon at all” Above quotes excerpted from The Complete Reference Collection. Copyright © 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997 The Learning Company, Inc. All Rights Reserved. And Von Braun piece form Wikipedia the free Internet encyclopedia.

Now today Bible believing Christians are ridiculed for what they believe, but those who ridicule do not know that the same Bible believing Christians who lived hundreds of years before them, were responsible for technologies they take for granted today. There was also many more Bible believing scientists of yesteryear I could have mentioned who still touches the lives of those who live today. However, how are we going to put the Bible to test via science? We are going to look at what some say are absurdities which the Bible states as fact and see what a scientific look at it will bring to light. Things like the story of Jonah and the great fish, Noah’s flood, or the rib of Adam to make Eve can we by any stretch of the imagination attach scientific data to those accounts to help those without faith? Therefore to help those who think you have lost your marbles just because you believe the Bible, let us look at this topic.

Verse One:
Genesis 1:1 KJV “In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth”.
Is that verse of scripture testable? No, therefore because it is not testable is it untrue? No, nothing can be proved true or untrue unless we had all the facts or all the evidence. So the proof we have here is the Word Of God.
Therefore what has ‘science’ to say on the subject? “Not only did matter come into existence at the big bang, but so also did the structure of the space-time. Space itself was shrunk to zero volume at the time of the big bang, and before the big bang, there was no “before”.”
Excerpted from The Complete Reference Collection. Copyright © 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997 The Learning Company, Inc. All Rights Reserved

The atheist scientists also have nothing and then something, the ‘big bang’ is called a theory, but a theory is a well-substantiated explanation of a subject, which the ‘big bang’ is certainly not. If the ‘big bang’ suggests 10-20 billion years of time, how can anyone say they know what happened at that time? The ‘big bang’ is a hypothesis, which is a good name for a guess that is all.

The Bible on the other hand states God creating as a fact. I challenge you to read up on the ‘big bang’ to see if it can be substantiated, because according to scientists, galaxies should not be grouped together like they are if the ‘big bang theory’ is true and I quote, “ The problem of explaining galaxies has proved to be one of the thorniest in cosmology. By all rights they shouldn’t be there, yet there they sit. It’s hard to convey the depth of frustration that this simple fact induces among scientists” Dr James Trefil, ‘The dark side of the Universe (New York: Macmillan Publishing Company, 1988) pp 3 and 55. As quoted by Jonathan Sarfati Ph.D. Refuting Evolution, Answers In Genesis, 1999

Just read this one: “we are forced to look to the period before 1 millisecond to explain the existence of galaxies.” That is one millisecond after the ‘big bang’ can you believe that? They only have one millisecond in 10-20 billion years to try and explain galaxies?
Dr James Trefil, for more go to http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/HBASE/astro/cosmo.html
Finally there is also a chicken and egg problem with stars, exploding stars are supposed the catalyst to new stars forming, therefore where did the first stars come from if they were not created? Like I said just read up on the ‘theories’ and find out that scientists that reject the Bible still have to prove why they reject it. We were bamboozled into believing that everything scientists say concerning origins are the truth while they are on television, in the meantime they are frantically working out in the background on how to prove what they so confidently put out as fact. Speaking about the chicken, just as a side track, evolutionists believe that the egg, that is the first chicken egg came before the chicken, and I am not making fun here, it is true, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_chicken_or_the_egg.

God says that he made the heavens and the earth; he also made the sun moon and stars. However about the sun, moon and stars He says, Genesis 1v 14 “And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years” This was written about 4000 years ago, today we calculate a year by the earth rotating around the sun, we calculate a month by the moon’s rotation around the earth, a day is of course calculated from the earths own rotation. However a week comes from the literal week of God’s work of creation, He said we shall work six days and rest one, and we still do it even though many people do not want to recognize God’s work of creation.

Verse Two:
Genesis 2:21-22 KJV “And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof; And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.”

Here is a story we all know and it is too simplistic for some, so are there any science we can attach to this story? Yes, I read the testimony of a doctor who had a massive car accident, in which he suffered too many injuries to mention, the fact is it was a miracle that he survived. In the following 51 months of recuperation and bone replacement to his face he noticed that the plastic surgeon went more than once to the right side of his chest to remove bone to be grafted into his face structure. When he asked the surgeon why he was not running out of bone, the surgeon replied that he was removing one of this man’s ribs and that this rib will replace itself in time if the procedure was done correct. Based on the testimony of Dr. Carl Wieland of Answers In Genesis, rib periosteum has a remarkable ability to regenerate bone, perhaps more so than any other bone. www.answersingenesis.org

So why did God take the rib again? It grows back, that is scientific, so men do not have one less rib than women and now we know why.

Verse Three:
Genesis 2:22 “And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man”.
So did Eve came from Adam? Somebody in a library was reading an evolutionist article and leaned over to me and said that the Adam and Eve story is just a fable, I do not know why he had to tell me that because we did not know each other. How I would have loved to have known the science facts then, which I know now.

The human male chromosomes are called the XY chromosomes and the female chromosomes the XX chromosomes. This is what a geneticist said, “I can assure you that medical science and genetics know that the sex of the child is determined at conception. Women always produce egg cells containing an X chromosome. Men produce two kinds of sperm cells, those containing an X chromosome and those containing a Y. These are produced in roughly equal numbers. If an X sperm cell fertilizes the egg, the child from the point of conception on is a girl (the XX chromosome condition). If it’s a Y-containing sperm cell that fertilizes the egg, the child is a boy from conception onward (the XY chromosome condition)… it’s the father who determines the sex of the child, genetically and statistically speaking”
Therefore scientifically/genetically a female comes from a male, because the male has the chromosomes for both sexes this is consistent with the manner of God’s creation, although God used a rib from the man to create the female. Think of it where else would the male and female sexes come from? This is what I have written in a previous article “Scientists has also found out that we all came from one female via the testing of mitochondrial DNA which is only passed on by the mother to daughter (so they found out what the Bible taught for 4000 years). They actually call this woman mitochondrial Eve. Now believe it or not but in 1997 two separate research teams from the University of Arizona and Stanford University announced that they also ‘tracked down’ the common male ancestor of us all. Sounds like Adam and Eve to me, but that is not what those scientists were putting forward, they suggest rather what they call a genetic bottleneck. It is alleged that our ancestors was some how bred or wiped out, except for those two who’s Y-chromosomes and mitochondrial DNA shows that we all came from them. It still sounds like Adam and Eve to me.”
From “Jesus Taught Against Evolution: Part Two” RD Kloosman, compiled from various sources. Find articles on the Internet about “mitochondrial eve”

The Bible teaches by deduction that the earth is about 6000 years old, that means Adam and Eve was created about 6000 years ago now just check out what a particular science experiment found, although scientists are quick to say that those facts should be checked again.
“The rate and pattern of sequence substitutions in the mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA) control region (CR) is of central importance to studies of human evolution and to forensic identity testing. Here, we report a direct measurement of the intergenerational substitution rate in the human CR. We compared DNA sequences of two CR hypervariable segments from close maternal relatives, from 134 independent mtDNA lineages spanning 327 generational events. Ten substitutions were observed, resulting in an empirical rate of 1/33 generations, or 2.5/site/Myr. This is roughly twenty-fold higher than estimates derived from phylogenetic analyses…”
Parsons TJ, Muniec DS, Sullivan K, Woodyatt N, Alliston-Greiner R, Wilson MR, Berry DL, Holland KA, Weedn VW, Gill P, Holland MM. Armed Forces DNA Identification Laboratory, Armed Forces Institute of Pathology, Rockville, Maryland 20850, USA.
The consequences of the above quoted experiment is that the mitochondrial “Eve” spoken of above lived about 6500 years ago, not 200000 years ago like some other tests suggest, which ties in with the Bible of course

What does the scientists say about chromosomes?
“X and Y chromosome diverged about 350 million years ago, when some reptile developed a gene which makes all its owners to be males. The chromosome with this gene became Y chromosome, and similar chromosome without it became X chromosome. So initially, X and Y-chromosomes were almost the same. Genes which were beneficial for males and harmful for females (male genes) either moved into Y chromosome or developed in it. This was beneficial for both sexes.”
References: Cordum, H.S., et. al. (2003) The male-specific region of the human Y chromosome is a mosaic of discrete sequence classes. Nature, 423, 825-837 Rozen, S., et. al. (2003) Abundant gene conversion between arms of palindromes in human and ape Y-chromosomes. Nature, 423, 873-876.

Remember according to evolutionists reptiles are in the lineage of humans. Therefore, so it seems that mammals did not evolve male and female versions, but inherited male and female characteristics from reptiles, if I understand evolutionists’ right.

Verse Four:
Genesis 7:4-6 “For yet seven days, and I will cause it to rain upon the earth forty days and forty nights; and every living substance that I have made will I destroy from off the face of the earth. And Noah did according unto all that the LORD commanded him. And Noah was six hundred years old when the flood of waters was upon the earth.”
The flood of Noah another hotly contested topic. Some say maybe there was a flood, but not worldwide only locally near where Noah lived. But someone asked the question; why did Noah build an ark and put animals in it if he could just walk over the ridge or mountain to escape? He knew long in advance about the flood. No there was a worldwide flood, but can science also prove it? They can if they want to, but do not expect any such graces from the world; they just hate to validate anything the Bible has to say.

What would be the evidence of a worldwide flood? Worldwide death and drowning of course. What about massive erosion (the Grand Canyon)? And a massive collection of things buried alive by mud and then trapped (fossils)? Now all things being equal you must admit what are mentioned above are the evidences we see today. Now why do we not hear of Noah’s flood being taught as fact if we have the evidence? Easy, the world just interprets the evidence differently. We see a flood that happened approximately 4500 years ago, but non Bible believing scientists see a fossil record of evolution of things millions of years old. People are strange having the same evidence they promptly interpret it differently.

Here is a paradox for you, scientists take rock, and they test it for age then in another place they take a fossil and test it for age. Then they go and if they find this fossil in another place they say that the rock is as old as the fossil, in another place they go and if they know the age of the rock and find a fossil in it, they say the fossil is as old as the rock, does that make sense?

They use a fossil to age the rock and the rock to age the fossil, circular reasoning at its best. But before you think I am sucking things out of my thumb read this, “It cannot be denied that from a strictly philosophical standpoint geologists are here arguing in a circle. The succession of organisms has been determined by a study of their remains embedded in the rocks, and the relative ages of the rocks are determined by the remains of organisms that they contain.”
R. H. Rastall (Lecturer in Economic Geology, Cambridge University), "Encyclopaedia Britannica”, 1956, vol. 10, p. 168.
“The procession of life was never witnessed, it is inferred. The vertical sequence of fossils is thought to represent a process because the enclosing rocks are interpreted as a process. The rocks do date the fossils, but the fossils date the rocks more accurately. Stratigraphy cannot avoid this kind of reasoning, if it insists on using only temporal concepts, because circularity is inherent in the derivation of time scales.” J. E. O’Rourke, "Pragmatism versus materialism in stratigraphy". "American Journal of Science”, vol. 276, January 1976, p. 53.

Aren’t scientists making themselves look foolish just to oppose the Bible?

To end off Noah’s flood how did the animals fit into the ark, for one there was no sea creatures in it, so it was only land animals on the ark, there is a book you can read on this topic, it was actually a feasibility study for the storing of animals. The measurements the Bible gives of the ark shows that the ark had the floor space of 569 railroad stock cars.

“Most Hebrew scholars believe the cubit to have been no less than 18 inches long [45.72 centimeters]. This means that the ark would have been at least 137.16 meters long, 22.86 meters wide and 13.716 meters high. Noah's Ark was said to have been the largest sea-going vessel ever built until the late nineteenth century when giant metal ships were first constructed. Its length to width ratio of six to one provided excellent stability on the high seas. In fact, modern shipbuilders say it would have been almost impossible to turn over. In every way, it was admirably suited for riding out the tremendous storms in the year of the flood.” By the way Noah’s arc had a triple storey construction.

The thing is there are logical answers that people would accept to questions if they knew the facts. For more read J Woodmorappe, Noah’s Ark: A Feasibility Study (El Cajon, CA: Institute for Creation Research, 1997) This person spent seven years on this study and all anti ark arguments are dealt with. The sciences of geology, stratigraphy and paleontology will attest to the flood of Noah if the facts were interpreted correctly.
See also www.christianansews.net, punch in Noah’s Flood and see what were the facts. Quote above from christiananswers.net article.

Verse Five:
Jonah 1:15-17 “So they took up Jonah, and cast him forth into the sea: and the sea ceased from her raging. Then the men feared the LORD exceedingly, and offered a sacrifice unto the LORD, and made vows. Now the LORD had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights.”

This Bible story is probably the one that takes the cake for absurdity according to non-believers, although you never know. The fact of the matter is that even theologians find it hard to believe it although I must say it is only the unbelieving ones who think Jesus Christ is not sure of His facts. Jesus is on record that He believed that Jonah was in deed in the belly of the great fish for three days. This is a ‘nice’ faith dilemma is it not, if I believe that Jonah was in the fish’s belly then the world would think I do not have all my ducks in a row. If I do not believe, than I say that Jesus did not have all His ducks in a row, therefore what or who do I believe? I do not want to tell you what to believe, because it is the Holy Spirit that will show you the truth, but if Jesus is in the equation, believe Him.

So can we attach scientific data to this example? Well yes, and no. The Bible states that God prepared a great fish to swallow Jonah, now if that was a miracle fish, then we cannot proof much because the facts will not be available, nevertheless some people like to think it was a whale and if it was a whale then we might have a case with evidence. It must be said, disputed evidence. Therefore let us look at the whale scenario although the words of the Bible are “great fish”.

A sperm whale, which is not the largest whale by the way, the blue whale is, can grow to about 17-20m, and weighs about 40-50 tons; they can swallow whole giant squids, which can reach 200 kilograms in weight.
“Sperm whales have the largest head of any animal. It can be about 6 m long, 3m high, and 2.1m across, and is about one-third of the whale's body length. The head has a distinctive box-like shape. The heads are frequently covered with circular scars that are made by the suckers of the giant squid that they hunt and eat”.
Just by the way the whale in the book Moby Dick is said to be a sperm whale.
Stats from www.enchantedlearning.com/whales

Whalers found that squids as large as abovementioned would be inside the stomach of these sperm whales when they would cut them up, because the sperm whale is also the largest carnivore on earth.

Therefore it is more than theoretically possible that large sea creatures can wholly swallow a man. Nevertheless it is stated that in 1895 a certain James Bartley who was a sailor on a whaling ship was cast out of a small boat near the ship as a whale catch (sperm whale) was underway. When he and a shipmate were cast out of the boat, the shipmate drowned but he was missing for two days. The whale was caught and a day and a half later as the crew was cutting up the whale, they found something alive in the whale’s belly, it was non other than the aforementioned James Bartley. The crew said that he had a bleached look and that he was unconscious when they found him.

James Bartley testified that he remembered only the boat capsizing and then remembered being inside something very slippery and that it was very hot there. He said that he could breathe but because of the heat he must have passed out. This story is however disputed and said to be based in truth, but not that the man was actually swallowed although the man did testify to the happenings.

One researcher of the story said that we would probably never know if it was true or not. But the fact remain that this could have happened theoretically as mentioned before that it is possible that someone can be swallowed by a great fish. Therefore we have two stories of men in fish, one in the Bible and one in 1895, both disputed, one is true. You can just punch in James Bartley on you Internet explorer and read up for yourself.

It is not my intention to come up for the Bible or trying to underpin the Bible by scientific explanations, but to show you that there is more to the Bible than meats the casual eye. People hear what scientists believe and what the Bible say and then take it that the scientists are right, it is by no means that easy for the unbelieving scientists. There are atheist scientists who wants nothing to do with the Bible who dispute with the so called evolutionists when it comes to issues of origins and theories like evolution which does not make sense. Therefore if you are one of those who think that everybody who wears a white coat and uses impressive vocabulary calling themselves objective scientists speak the truth, you will be easily misled. Somebody said, “scientists are also more or less human”.

We as Christians must know like was said before, that our brothers and sisters had major parts to play in the development of science on this planet. Did you know that before the final preparations was made before Neil Armstrong was to step out on to the moon, this happened, “Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin were the first men to walk on the moon in the Apollo 11 space mission. Michael Collins third member of the group, was in charge of the command module, essential for their return to earth, which circled the moon while Armstrong and Aldrin landed. The moon lander touched down at 3:17 Eastern Standard Time, Sunday, July 20, 1969.

Aldrin had brought with him a tiny communion kit, given to him by his church, that had a silver chalice and wine vial about the size of the tip of his finger. During the morning he radioed, "Houston, this is Eagle. This is the LM pilot speaking. I would like to request a few moments of silence. I would like to invite each person listening in, whoever or wherever he may be, to contemplate for a moment the events of the last few hours, and to give thanks in his own individual way." "In the radio blackout," he wrote later, "I opened the little plastic packages which contained the bread and the wine. I poured the wine into the chalice our church had given me. In the one-sixth gravity of the moon, the wine slowly curled and gracefully came up the side of the cup. Then I read the Scripture, 'I am the vine, you are the branches. Whosoever abides in me will bring forth much fruit.' I had intended to read my communion passage back to earth, but at the last minute Deke Slayton had requested that I not do this. NASA was already embroiled in a legal battle with Madelyn Murray O'Hare, the celebrated opponent of religion, over the Apollo 8 crew reading from Genesis while orbiting the moon at Christmas. I agreed reluctantly..." "Eagle's metal body creaked. I ate the tiny Host and swallowed the wine. I gave thanks for the intelligence and spirit that had brought two young pilots to the Sea of Tranquility. It was interesting for me to think: the very first liquid ever poured on the moon, and the very first food eaten there, were the communion elements.”
From an article by Bill Carrell. http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/communion.html

Just by the way of the 29 Apollo astronauts, 23 were Protestant and six were Catholic. God has had a hand in all of our human endeavors and His Word does not stand back when a scientist speak his own hypothesis because it is the truth and not cleverly devised fables.

Copyright 2007 Richard D Kloosman. All rights reserved

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Member Comments
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Thomas Kittrell 05 Jun 2006
This is very interesting. Thank you. It is so refreshing to see articles from the creationist view. I am tired of having the evolutionists views crammed down our throats, so to speak. Thomas


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